Have you ever lost a faithful animal companion? Maybe they were a beloved family pet? Perhaps you work with animals, you might be a vet or a pet groomer and feel impacted when those animals pass away. This episode with Renee, a Pet Loss Counsellor is for you!
In today’s episode Renee shares her own story of losing her dog Buckley. We discuss why it is so important for people to know that coming to therapy for pet loss is valid and needed. We also talk about some of the misconceptions people have about grief and in particular pet grief.
Who is Renee?
Renee Magri is a Grief Counsellor that specialises in Pet Loss Support for before and after the loss of our Animal Friends.
Her passion for this much needed support grew immensely after losing her beloved Boxer Buckley to a terminal illness at the young age of 5 and a half. Having always had a keen interest in grief and loss, it was a natural progression for her to take her qualification and direct it to helping the wider community with what can be one of the most difficult losses you will ever go through in your lifetime.
More details about Renee and her practice can be found on her website
You can find Renee over on Instagram and you can also find her on Facebook where she has a support group available
Our latest episode is now live on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and all major podcast platforms. And guess what? The transcript is available below for your reading pleasure. Happy listening!
Transcript
SAM SELLERS:
[00:11] Hello and welcome to Inside the Therapy Room. I’m your host, Sam Sellers. I’m a registered therapist, a wife, and a fur mama, and I’m passionate about breaking down the barriers and stigma attached to therapy. I want to begin by honouring the traditional custodians of the land we live and work on. Today, Renee is in Wurundjuri country and Sam is on Gundungurra land. We pay our respects to the elders’ past, present, and emerging, for they hold the memories, the traditions, and cultures of our First Nations people. We must always remember that the land below our feet is, was and always will be Aboriginal land.
[00:54] Today we’re chatting to Renee Magri, who is a grief counsellor that specializes in pet loss support for before and after the loss of our animal friends. Her passion for this much needed support grew immensely after losing her beloved boxer, Buckley, to a terminal illness at the young age of five and a half. Having always had a keen interest in grief and loss, it was a natural progression for her to take her qualifications and direct it to helping the wider community with what can be one of the most difficult losses you will ever go through. Tune in to hear her share about working with those who have experienced pet loss, talking about when someone may need this type of support, the impact pet loss can have on someone, and what it’s like inside her therapy room, which is virtual. And finally, what myth she would love to smash around pet grief. We hope you enjoy joining us inside the therapy room.
[01:57] Welcome, Renee. How are you going?
RENEE MAGRI:
Hi, I’m well. I’m well. How are you?
SAM SELLERS:
I am great. You are in Melbourne, correct?
RENEE MAGRI:
I’m just outside of Melbourne, probably about 50 minutes from the CBD, but not far.
SAM SELLERS:
It is wonderful to have you here. So, you are a grief counsellor, but you specialise in a unique area, which is around pet loss. So, tell us a little bit about what brought you to specializing in pet grief and pet loss.
RENEE MAGRI:
[02:28] Sure, absolutely. I’d first like to say thank you for inviting me and thank you for having me. And I’m delighted to be here with you. A little bit about my story of what brought me here. At the end of 2016, I lost one of the greatest loves of my life, which is my boxer, Buckley. And like many others, he was and still is my very best friend and one of the greatest loves of my life. So, he was diagnosed with a terminal illness at the very young age of three years and 10 months, which shook me out of my core, honestly. And yeah, we were given a six-to-12-month prognosis with him. We had 20 months with him.
[03:17] And yeah, after he passed away, the grief that came to me was huge. And I was feeling a whole lot of things that I hadn’t never felt before. And yeah, at that time, I was almost at the end, I had about four months to go with my counselling studies and almost there with finishing that and always had an interest in grief and loss. So, it was like a natural thing for the two things to come together because I knew that I was not the only one that felt such a profound sense of grief. So, it was a natural progression for me. And yeah, a few months later I decided to become a niche pet loss counsellor, pet loss grief counsellor. And yeah, been in the space for about six and a half years now.
SAM SELLERS:
[04:04] Love that. I mean, I think a running theme that is happening as I’m sort of doing these episodes is that everybody’s niche tends to just happen organically. And I think most people don’t necessarily expect to land in that space, but it happens. And I think that that’s when you know that it’s the right space for you. It does also tend to come out of lived experience as well. You know, I think it’s what drives us is our own experience. For those of you guys, people out there who are watching this, Renee’s sweet boy is behind her. And if you are listening or reading, jump on YouTube, which is where this will be or onto your social media, I’m assuming where he will be. What breed is he?
RENEE MAGRI:
Buckley is a boxer. So, for anyone, anyone that has a boxer or knows somebody with a boxer, they will know that yes, they’re very playful, very goofy, very funny, very loyal, and big smoochy boys and girls. So, he’s always been my boy and yeah, they’re a great breed. But of course, everyone thinks they’ve got the best.
SAM SELLERS:
[05:18] It is one of those things that it’s like the dog version of like Apple or Samsung. It’s like everybody thinks that they’ve got the sweetest, most loving breed. I was mentioning to you before we started that I have my own experience as well with pet loss and my sweet Barney was a King Charles Cavalier and they are obviously a beautiful, sweet natured breed. So, I think everybody thinks that they’ve got the best. We have a Cavoodle now though. She’s sweet.
RENEE MAGRI:
Oh, beautiful.
SAM SELLERS:
[05:52] Yeah. She’s got super bad separation anxiety. She just loves being with people. And so, but I think it just solidifies that bond that you build with not just dogs, but any sort of pet or animal companion, there is that huge bond.
RENEE MAGRI:
Yeah. Oh, there is.
SAM SELLERS:
Who would be looking for this type of support? Who falls into this category?
RENEE MAGRI:
[06:17] Yeah. Thank you for asking that question because having the conversations and talking about it is helpful. So, who would be? Now in terms of pet loss grief, there’s different types of loss and that’s going to affect everybody differently. And so, I’ll start off with pre-loss, leading up to potentially end of life decisions. That’s a big factor there. There’s a lot of what’s called anticipatory grief that normally stems in there. So, essentially that means grief before a loss. So, there’s support there. If somebody’s companion is starting to age, they might not be terminal yet, but age is creeping up on them. So, there’s numerous things there. Also, of course, post-loss and yeah, after we’ve lost our companions, there’s grief after the loss.
[07:15] Another type of grief and loss that can come in very much so with pet loss grief is what’s called ambiguous grief. There can be a lot of ambiguity. And I can give you a couple of examples of that. And that would be if your companion has run away, if they’ve been stolen from you, which both things are so very hard, and it does unfortunately happen. If there was something like a relationship breakdown and sometimes there’s shared custody, but often there’s not. And one person has sole custody of their companion. So, therefore the other person doesn’t have any involvement in their life anymore. We always hope that can be worked out, but sometimes it doesn’t. Rehoming. And there’s many reasons that that can happen. Moving overseas for a job and many people can’t take their companions with them. Some people just can’t. So, there’s going to be lots of variables sitting in there, but there’s a lot in there that grief can be present.
SAM SELLERS:
[08:24] I’m wondering, I’m thinking about animals can get illnesses and things like that in terms of there could be animals who might need a limb amputated or might go blind or things like that. And so, the pet that once was is no longer, it’s sort of that can change a pet’s temperament. It can change their personality. And so, I’m wondering if there’s space in that ambiguous grief as well for that, that would be difficult. Because you’ve still got your pet, you’ve still got your companion. But they look different, and their personality is different and they’re not the same as they once were, which can be really difficult.
RENEE MAGRI:
[09:09] Yeah. Thank you for mentioning that. That’s something that can come out within the grief. So, you’re losing who you both were, three things presenting themselves. So, that’s a good thing to mention that absolutely can be there. Something like that can also sit when we have a diagnosis and our relationship is one way, and then it steps into palliation and palliative care. You’re always caring, loving, and supporting. That doesn’t shift, but yeah, there could be some grief there where the relationship, I just want to reiterate is very connected still, but there’s things that you’re missing, and it could be daily walks that you used to do together that you can’t do anymore. Things like that. So absolutely. So, there’s a lot within the grief space that resides next to our animal companions when things happen.
SAM SELLERS:
[10:04] Absolutely. I’m also thinking about, like I mentioned, our girl Naya has separation anxiety. So, if we go anywhere, we have a pet sitter who comes and looks after her. And so, I’m thinking people who work in that space, she is the only person we use, she’s here relatively regularly and has known Naya since she was a pup. And so, it would almost be a loss, a grief around losing a pet that wasn’t even their own as well. That’s a really sort of messy, complex space to sit in because it’s like, “well, they weren’t my pet”, but it’s still grief, it’s still loss. And it’s still something that deserves a space to be held and worked through.
RENEE MAGRI:
[11:00] Yeah. Thank you for mentioning that as well. That’s another very good thing to raise and to create awareness around. I think awareness is one of the biggest things that, it’s one of my favourite words by my clients. I’ll often talk to them from the get-go. I’ll say, “you’re going to hear me say the word awareness a few times” but you never have enough of it. And that’s really an important thing that you mentioned because our people that are caring for animals in some capacity, whether it’s a service-based industry or friend, like if you’ve got within your family dynamics you might have another family member’s dog or a friend, I’ve had several times said that to me as well, that they know somebody’s dog and they’re grieving them because they’re such a big part of everybody’s life. I mean, they’re the true testament of unconditional love, our animal friends. I always say they ask for very little and they give us so, so much back in return.
SAM SELLERS:
[12:00] I feel like one of the things that comes out of my mouth so many times as my wife and I watch way too much TikTok videos and a good 50% of those videos are dog videos. And so, I feel like I say the words, “we don’t deserve dogs” come out of my mouth so many times because I think as you said, they are just the, we’re focusing very much on dog’s cause that’s where my heart is, but you know, they are the epitome of unconditional love. And if you’re ever in a bad mood, just find a dog, they’ll put you a better place.
RENEE MAGRI:
Oh, they sure will.
SAM SELLERS:
[12:44] I focused a bit on, on dogs, but there are other pets, cats, birds, horses, all pet loss is pet loss, regardless of what pet it is, how long you had it, those sorts of things. I think that’s important to note. We talked about a very popular pet, but there are a variety of other pets that fall into this category as well.
RENEE MAGRI:
[13:12] There sure is. There sure is. I think fur, feathers, or scales, every single one of them, we have a unique bond with every single one of the species in the animal world.
SAM SELLERS:
That’s a really great way to say it.
RENEE MAGRI:
I’ve got an alpaca. So, there you go. So, I’ve got my goofy boy and people that follow me on my socials would know a bit about Sir Goofy, as I call him.
SAM SELLERS:
[13:41] Love that. I love the fur feathers and scales. The challenge in me is to come up with a pet that doesn’t fall into that category. But I’m not sure that there is. I’m trying to think of one, but I can’t seem to because they do tend to.
RENEE MAGRI:
Let me know.
SAM SELLERS:
[14:10] What do you want people to know? Like, what is there something in terms of pet loss, pet grief that people might not be aware of?
RENEE MAGRI:
[14:18] Yeah, sure. There’s lots and lots of things, but I think the first thing I’d like to share with you is to let the community know is that support is available. There is support out there and in many different forms, whether that be private sessions, support groups, whatever it may be. And nothing is ever crazy, silly, or stupid. What you think within your own pet loss grief space. And that is something, that narrative has been said to me hundreds of times. Conversation would go, “Renee, you might think I’m silly and crazy thinking this, but I’m thinking…” No, nothing is crazy. It’s what you feel. And it really has a voice, and it has meaning. So, that is the first thing.
[15:12] With grief itself, maybe just a quick difference between what is grief and mourning, because that can be a little bit confusing. And I think it’s helpful to try to create like a foundation when you’re trying to process something that’s very profound in your life. So, that’s one thing I really like to create a foundation. So, the difference between grief and mourning. So, grief is what we feel on the inside, our thoughts, and feelings. We can feel that emotionally and physically. So, something to be aware of. And mourning is how you express that. So, that’s the difference. And another thing, and these are my own thoughts, is that grief can’t be fixed. Grief is something that we learn to process and carry and integrate into our life. It’s a very individual journey. No one will grieve the same way. So, to fix, I’ll speak about sort of myself. If I was to fix my grief with my Buckley, I’d have to have him back living and by my side. And unfortunately, that’s not going to happen.
[16:17] So, to me, don’t get over it. We don’t move on. I’m not going to be okay with it one day and just, wake up and go, “Oh, okay. Buckley’s died.” That’s not negotiable for me. So, we can’t fix it. That’s my thoughts. The other thing is there’s no rush. There are no time limits with this. Another conversation I have all the time would be, “Renee. I’ve been feeling this for two years. What’s happening?” So, there’s no time limits. I’ll have grief with me for the rest of my life for Buckley, forever. So, it’s with me for the long-term.
SAM SELLERS:
[16:55] It’s funny that you mentioned that not being any sort of rush because it will be four years in December since we lost Barney. And I still have him as my background on my phone. I still have the profile picture on my Facebook page that I changed it to back in that year. And I only said to my wife last night, “actually, I still can’t change it.” There is still that part of me that just it’s a way that I honor him. It’s just and it is it’s too painful still to change that. Yes, I have healed, and I hold that grief very differently than I did four years ago, even two years ago. But it is it’s never just suddenly going to be okay. I think I tell my clients all the time, “we don’t need to make sense of something, because if it doesn’t need to make sense. When we make sense of something, we rationalise it, and it becomes okay. And this is it doesn’t ever need to be okay. It will never be okay.” My sweet boy died on the side of the road, that’s never going to be okay.
[18:11] And so, I think that that’s important for people, because it is one of those griefs where people sort of go, “aren’t you over by now?” Like just like you said, “just get another dog”, “get another pet”, “replace it.” It’s not as simple as that. So, I think that that’s a really important point that people sort of do need to remember that it is okay to still be grieving, and still be mourning, still be holding that years down the track, because it’s not something that is just absolutely going to go away or disappear.
RENEE MAGRI:
[18:50] Absolutely. Absolutely. I couldn’t agree more. And I really want to normalize this, I want to normalize and validate and acknowledge pet loss grief, and what you’re feeling as well. And just to give you a very snapshot parallel, I mean, Buckley died seven years ago, I still have his bed out, behind me on my shelving behind here I’ve still got his medicine basket, he was on all these different meds, is the same way as it was on from the day that he passed away. And I just got it there, I’ve got his behind me as well, his collar, his lead, things like that. And why? It’s because I want to. The right way to grieve is your way, is our way. And there’s no right and there’s no wrong and you can’t grieve wrong. The right way is your way. So, this is why it’s so, so individualized and nothing is wrong.
[19:49] Others might have their thoughts and opinions and might try to tell you that you should be over it and all those things. But at the end of the day, I look at that, that’s someone’s thoughts and feelings, and they’re allowed to have that. It doesn’t mean it’s true and it doesn’t mean it’s right, it’s the way we choose to receive that or not. And then channel into what serves you, what’s going to help you process and work through. And I mentioned before that we can’t fix grief, but there is so much we can do to support it, to guide it, to work on ways to have it there. And that is going to be different for everybody. And the grief journey, I keep saying, is very individual, it’s going to be different. But that’s one thing I would like people to know, your listeners, is that there is support there to hug it tight. Grief doesn’t feel nice, it feels very uncomfortable a lot of the time. So, our mindset can be, how do I fix this? What do I do? You know, if we had all the answers, I would give them to everybody, I would, I would give the instructions, I would give all the text.
[21:10] You know, we learn about things, but it’s about operationalizing things our way. And it’s what resonates with one, might not be with the other. And this is why I say there’s no rush, it’s one step at a time. I think if we rush and force it, that can add pressure. And we don’t want to add more in there. So, it’s very much where you are. And I really try to encourage that. The disenfranchised, that’s a bit of a tongue twister word, disenfranchised. So, let’s just say, disenfranchised grief can be very much in the animal world too. So, very quickly, for anyone that wasn’t sure what that is, it’s when your grief and loss doesn’t get acknowledged by others or society. And Sam, as you mentioned before, it’s when that narrative of, “it was just a bird, you can just go and get another one, get over.” Oh, I always get a bit… when I hear that.
SAM SELLERS:
[22:19] Yeah, absolutely. I mean, and it’s one of those really ironic sorts of situations in terms of still having, like you mentioned, having the collar and the bed and things like that. Because if we lose human loved ones, we still have, we still have belongings, we still have little trinkets, we might still have grandma’s vase in the cupboard or on the mantelpiece, their photos out, their clothes. I have a few pieces of my dad’s clothing in my wardrobe and sentimental pieces. And that’s very normalized to keep those trinkets and it’s a way to memorialize them in our present world. And so, I think the more that we can normalize that our furry… I think I found a loophole in your fur feathers and scales. I think we have shells because we have crustaceans. My mum used to have yabbies. And so, I was like, “Oh, they don’t fall into that.” So, we’ve got shells. Let’s add shells to that.
RENEE MAGRI:
[23:28] Shells. Yeah, that’s a good one. Let me write that down. I have written that down.
SAM SELLERS:
[23:34] But I think we just need to find space to normalize the fact that this grief is just as valid and just as normal as human grief. And the way that we memorialize that is no different to the way that we would memorialize human grief.
RENEE MAGRI:
Absolutely, for sure.
SAM SELLERS:
We sort of led into it when you were talking about there’s no right or wrong way to grieve. So, tell us, I guess, a little bit about what this group of people, so anybody who is experiencing any form of pet loss, pet grief, what are they going to experience in the room with you specifically? What’s that?
RENEE MAGRI:
[24:19] Yeah. Well, I really do my best to create a very safe space, first and foremost. So, that’s something I always do my best, and let the person with me settle into the session space at a pace that’s best for them. So, all emotions are allowed. I really, really like to put out there because it often is a very emotional time for them and it’s hard. It’s hard to be able to talk and express such deep pain. So, I really like to bring that out so, so much. And anything we don’t want to talk about, that’s so okay, just let me know. So, it’s about just going at things at their pace. There’s often within the grief space, what I call different layers within pet loss grief. And some examples of that would be the feelings of guilt, sadness, loneliness, a shift in somebody’s identity too, can very much shift. You’re known for somebody with your companion and when they’re not there, you don’t know who you are. Lack of motivation to do things, creating a new normal. There’s a lot going on.
[25:39] So, yeah, that space of unpacking it at that person’s pace. So, within that, there’s many ways. Some people like to just chat about things. I can generally, I like to listen very much as much as I can. And once I listen and hear what is going on for that person, then I’m always guiding and supporting the whole time, of course. So, we might step into learning some simplistic, effective coping suggestions, coping tips, things that I think can really benefit to meet that person where they’re at in that here and now. Now that can ebb and flow. I can bring some visuals into the session and things like that, but it’s really from where I’m sitting. It’s about, as I said, really listening and really trying to get on specific and clearly identify what is going on for that person.
[26:47] Prior to me meeting somebody for the first time, there’ll be a very simplistic intake information process where I ask some on point questions, I like to think. And that is so important to me. And I’ll often go over that two or three times to get an idea before we even meet of where that person is at. I also invite, if my client would like to, prior to me even meeting them, to share with me, only if they wanted to, some photos of their beloved. I invite them to share a few words about them, their beautiful everlasting love and relationship, if they’d like to, there’s no obligation. Some people do and some people prefer, because that can be upsetting too, but when I receive that, my heart is warmed. I love seeing the photos. It’s also a space where people can bring photos in and show me, they might have the items of their beloved. We might talk about that. We might talk about, for example, I love the sensory things, like what we can see here, smell. Now sensory is so supportive within the pet loss grief space.
[28:01] So, we might bring that in. We might talk about it. We might talk about how, whether it’s a bird swing or a collar or a horse bridle, whatever it may be, how we can incorporate that into support. Because my thing is relationships continue, love continues, love doesn’t die. I’m such a big, you can hear my voice getting really, passionate, because that is that is one of my biggest things on my own personal journey with Buckley that has supported me. So, there’s many, many, many different things that we can bring in, and everyone’s so unique and every journey is unique. And I really take that on. It’s not one size fits all by any means So, I hope that’s given just a little bit of a snapshot of what a session would be like.
SAM SELLERS:
[28:57] I mean, I think people have this imagery and I probably did as well before I got into this industry, that grief therapy is morbid. It’s just a lot of crying. It’s just overwhelming. It’s all consuming. And there absolutely are times of that. But I find for a lot of people, and once I got to the stage where I was able to, one of the most beautiful parts of grief therapy was having somebody who was just going to listen to me talk about all of the wonderful things about him, who wanted to know all of those things, who was happy for me to sit there and show them a hundred photos that I took, and all of that can be a really beautiful moment in that grief journey. And it’s not all doom and gloom and it’s not all sad. There are those pockets of beauty where you get that undivided attention from somebody, particularly the other people in your family are also grieving and everybody’s journey is looking different. It makes it difficult to have those pockets where you get to just talk about your loved pet and companion without feeling like you also need to hold space for somebody else in the family. So, it’s a beautiful part of grief therapy.
RENEE MAGRI:
[30:34] Oh, absolutely. The other thing is true that comes in is relief. It’s a relief for people as for all the things that you said. It’s a relief to be able to say things that you have a reservation with people within your own network that you might be judged, criticized, your loss won’t be validated. In saying all that, there’s also a lot of wonderful support through family and friends. I’ve heard because that’s something I always do really check in on how’s your support system? What’s there? If there’s not, how can we work on that if you need more? But so, there’s a lot of I really want to acknowledge and thank family and friends that are supporting their loved one with such a profound loss of their animal companion. And thank you for understanding and thank you for being that person to be there. This is the thing with grief, because there can be a mentality from family and friends that we need to try to fix that person. They can tend to sort of want to try to do all these sorts of things that they think could be helpful. And their heart is normally in the right place. But a lot of the time, it’s not overly helpful. And I say that with my hand on my heart because their heart is in the right place.
[31:51] And sometimes it’s hard just to sit with grief. It is that I’m not sure we’re coding it by any means, because it can be very, very difficult. But I really love how you said that the session space can be very emotional, we’re really acknowledging that. But it’s also another side that can really open so much, I’m going to say opportunity to give you hope to work with these challenges to healing. Life is going to be different. There’s a before and there’s an after and it looks very different. So, there’s a new normal, there’s a lot to carry and process. We’re absolutely acknowledging that. But one thing that brings me, it’s a privilege for what I do, but when I see somebody, and you would relate to this, Sam, I’m sure very much so that we start the session, particularly the first session, and there is apprehension going into a session. Hand up for me too. I’ve been to counselling.
SAM SELLERS:
It’s daunting sometimes.
RENEE MAGRI:
[32:58] It is, it’s going to be daunting and terrifying, and there’s a lot of anticipation stepping into the session. What I love and warms my heart and the relatability, I said with you as well, is that when you see that person sort of settle in more into the session and know that this is a safe space, know that I can say whatever I want, and I won’t be judged. I can see that transformation as the session goes on, which it just gives me, it’s just a feeling of just heart warmed in that I can be there to let them be them, authentically them. And I’m sure you could feel that too.
SAM SELLERS:
[33:40] Yeah, I mean, one of my favourite things is to tell my clients that I want this space, because it’s hard to create a space that is completely safe because we don’t know what that looks like for somebody, but I like to tell my clients that I want to create a space that’s filter free. I want you to not have to filter your words, your language, your experience for the sake of me. It is my job to sync up with you, not the other way around. And so, people sort of tend to relate to that because you do often hear, “I shouldn’t say that in front of such and such because it’ll make them upset” or something like that. And so, one of the most beautiful parts of therapy in general, but particularly grief therapy, I think is that ability to not have to filter your experience.
[34:37] I want to quickly say something before we get to my favourite part of the podcast, which is the smashing of myths. I want to shout out to all the parents out there. Send your kids to therapy when a pet dies if they’re struggling with it, because children feel pet grief just as much as we adults do sometimes, if not more. They’re little humans with big emotions and they need space to be able to process the loss of pets as well. It is not just adults who need this space, it’s the little ones in our worlds as well because it’s a lot. It’s a lot for them to understand just even on a base level that their beloved family pet is no longer coming home. And so, that’s a big concept for little ones to understand. And so, they need space.
[35:36] They need the space to be able to work through that. And to not pressure them to feel okay about it in a quick manner. Just because you might be processing it well doesn’t mean that your children need to process it in the same way, and to allow space for that. It might not be therapy, but it might be creating a little garden in the backyard where they can have a little memorial in the same way that we would with a human. We have funerals, we have grief rituals, we can do all the same things. And I think kids need that space just as much if not more.
RENEE MAGRI:
[36:17] Thank you for talking about that too because it’s bang on. We look at all the animals and how much children, they’re their best friends, a lot of them, how they rely on them, how they support them, how they can calm them. That’s another big conversation, but absolutely, yes.
SAM SELLERS:
[36:38] And I always say there’s a book for everything these days. People are so creative at creating resources for adults and children alike. There is a book for everything. So, there are things out there where I think we both can probably understand that therapy is not accessible for everybody on a financial level or on a location level, but there are books, there are resources, there are things online that can help you in your family home process that grief. Really wholesome and authentic way that doesn’t involve therapy because like I said, always an accessible service.
[37:22] Let’s smash a myth, Renee. I love this. This is my favorite part of the podcast. Like I’ve said in all these episodes, I’ve asked you guys all to think of a myth that you would like to smash about your passion space. What is that myth that we’re smashing?
RENEE MAGRI:
[37:42] I’ve been thinking about this one and there can be different ways that it can be approached, but I don’t know if it’s so much a myth, but more just I guess a message or something that I want to put out there to potentially people that don’t really, I’m going to say where the disenfranchisement space sits in, I just want to say pet loss grief is real grief. That it is real grief and I just want people to know that. Pet loss grievers would know that, but people outside of that space, it’s real grief. Never think like you must move on or get over it. That’s another kind of thing that society can put on you that you should be feeling a certain way by a certain time.
[38:38] So, I don’t know if that’s a myth, but more just I guess a message that don’t feel like you need to move on. And it’s never ever just a pet. Never ever. It’s never ever, no matter what anybody tells you, it’s never ever just a pet.
SAM SELLERS:
[39:09] I think that is a myth. I think pet loss being like a real loss and a real grief, I think there is an element in there that is a bit of a myth because I think there are some people sadly who don’t validate, understand, affirm that that is real pain. That is real grief, and it doesn’t just look like sadness. I mean, when I lost Barney, I had what we would describe as PTSD symptoms. I was having nightmares. I had flashbacks. I couldn’t go, like I said to you before, we would drive three hours out of our way to visit family because I could not drive on that stretch of the road. And so, I think there does need to be that smashing of it not being real and it just being sad. It goes much beyond that.
[40:11] And there is a real element of trauma that can go into pet loss and pet grief. And I think let’s get rid of that notion that it is somehow not a normal grief that it doesn’t look like sadness.
RENEE MAGRI:
[40:29] Someone will listen. And someone will listen to you, even when you think someone there isn’t anyone. That’s one of my biggest things, I don’t want anyone to feel like they’re alone and you’ve got to carry this all on your own, because if it’s not a myth, let’s make it one because you don’t have to carry it. You don’t have to carry it. And whether it’s with me or other support platforms, there are a whole range of things like you tapped on before. Therapy isn’t for everyone, but there are so many other things out there, whether it’s a book, all those things. It could be some affirmation cards. It could be resources. There are so many wonderful things out there. Yeah, it’s what you connect with. And yeah, it is hard, but when you step into things, you might be surprised how things can really help you process these tough challenges.
SAM SELLERS:
[41:31] Absolutely. And on that note, I think a really great way to end this is going to be that if you need to find that space that, Renee, you mentioned that you have a support group. So, I think that might be a beautiful way to end this that if you don’t have your people, if you don’t have that community, if you don’t have people who are going to affirm that that loss is real, maybe this space might be a really great space for like-mindedness. Have you got a little tidbit about that support group?
RENEE MAGRI:
[42:05] Oh, very, very much so. I love my support groups. We’ve got a beautiful community, which is so important, I think. If you can be with like-minded people who you can relate to, who you can share your truth with, talk about your beloved, it can be so helpful. So, yes, I do have my own Facebook support group. It’s my group. I admin it. The members are beautiful. I had so much [inaudible] about it, how the group has just been there for them. I try to put as much on the group as I can, whether that’s sharing some tips, I try to do a live here and there. I need to clone me; I need to have another one of me. But I do my best. But that is there. It’s free. It doesn’t cost anything. And everyone is most welcome. And I know online people will be “Hmm”, but I say this with the kindest heart, I’m a very fair, reasonable person, but I don’t tolerate any keyboard stuff. We have rarely anything, rarely, but I just wanted to put that out there to let anyone know if that’s a concern.
[43:19] And if there was, if, as I said, rarely, I stomp it out quickly. And if I don’t see it, my members are so beautiful and supportive. I might just get a quick message, “Hey Renee, you haven’t seen this, you need to act on it.” But so, anyone’s welcome to be with us if they’d like to be.
SAM SELLERS:
[43:36] I think that’s great. I think it’s amazing. One of the running themes that is sort of popping up in all my episodes is that concept, and its sort of how I run, well not run, but it’s my purpose in a lot of the things that I do with my business is that concept of to be seen as to be understood. And I think that that’s the most beautiful thing about community spaces like that, is that there is the ability to feel understood by people you don’t even know. And I think that that’s a beautiful way to sort of experience that, it’s such a vital part of that healing journey. I think not just with grief, but with everything. So, I think that’s a wonderful service.
[44:23] Thanks for joining me. It’s been wonderful.
RENEE MAGRI:
That’s a pleasure. It has been wonderful. We could keep talking and talking and I know time is of the essence, and the time goes so quickly, doesn’t it? It’s just been wonderful. And again, I really thank you for not only inviting me, but giving a platform and a space to talk about pet loss support. I’m very grateful. So, I do thank you. And I’m really hoping that your listeners, I’m hoping there’s lots of takeaways that they can receive and take away from this episode. So, thank you so much.
SAM SELLERS:
[45:01] Thank you. I think it’s just an important space. And I think thank you for doing the work. When somebody comes to me and they tell me that they’ve had a pet die, I’m welling up already. So, thank you for being able to sit in that space with people. So, it’s a beautiful space. Thank you so much. And all of Renee’s details will be in the description for people to be able to find you. If you find socials, support groups, services, all of that will be there for people to be able to find them.
RENEE MAGRI:
Thank you. Thank you so much.
SAM SELLERS:
Thanks so much Renee.
RENEE MAGRI:
Awesome. Thanks Sam then. Take care.
SAM SELLERS:
[45:47] We hope you enjoyed joining us Inside the Therapy Room. Thanks for listening.